When correcting a child, the goal is to apply light, not heat.
Is it just me or are there others who are equally disheartened by how many people have applauded the dad who shot his teenager’s computer after she used it to bash him on Facebook? And I’m not just talking about parents of teenagers. Young people think this guy is cool.
Is this really our country? Is old-fashioned humiliation considered heroic parenting? Are we seriously claiming that intimidation is an expression of love?
I’m sorry, but this particularly obnoxious teenage apple hasn’t fallen far from the tree. You don’t teach someone respect; they learn it.
To be honest, I haven’t read this troubled girl’s Facebook post or her father’s outrageous videotaped response–because I know it would only outrage me further; and what concerns me is not one misguided parent, but all those who applaud him.
Have we become a country that is so afraid of our teenagers that we celebrate their alienation? Do we have so much shame about own youthful abandon that we need punish someone for absolution? Or have teenagers become the scapegoat for our disillusionment with ourselves and this country?
Recently a colleague bemoaned American parenting when she read that French toddlers were capable of sitting at a dinner table for over an hour; while American children demand immediate gratification.
This isn’t about AMERICAN CHILDREN, THIS IS ABOUT AMERICAN CULTURE!
MIRROR, MIRROR, on the wall…
Kelly Salasin, February 2012
Part II. Would Father Have Used Facebook and a Gun to Teach his SON a Lesson?
Part III. Dear Mr. Jordan & Other Parents Frustrated with Teens & Chores
Part IV. Father Who Used FB to Teach His Daughter A Lesson: A Human Rights Issue
57 thoughts on “Rebuttal to Dad Who Used Facebook to “Teach His Daughter a Lesson””
Intimidating young adults does NOT work in the long run, despite their apparent “obedience” in the beginning. In fact it’s a great way to engender fear and hate. I personally know someone who used intimidation and public humiliation as a teaching technique on a dear friend throughout their childhood and teen years. Result: My friend is unswervingly convinced that this aggressive behavior was engineered out of hate, rather than love (which she bought until she was about 19). She gave up trying to respect or consider the other persons feelings, opinions and advice and today struggles to stay positive and social. This was nothing short of emotional abuse. Intimidation, manipulation and humiliation are NOT good, strong parenting techniques. They’re just acts of cruelty, that are a reflection of serious psychological issues.
Note: The intimidator applauded the father from the video and found it quite amusing, as would be expected.
In Australia we don’t have firearms in our homes so this footage of a father shooting his teen’s laptop is very disturbing to me. My children are almost adults now and they have learnt to respect their elders, their parents and themselves simply through example.
This father has unwittingly made his teen a hero to other teens because they will rally around her and lament with her about the way he treats her. It isn’t that hard to treat each other with love and respect. I do think that sometimes you need tough love for your kids but only when they are acting in a way that is unsafe.
You’re absolutely right.
This person is a poor example of a father. His perverse actions and threats to a 15 year old girl are that of a Coward. My initial thoughts of his and his wife’s parenting tactics were their striking similarities to those of Judge Adams and the way he threatened, mistreated and abused his daughter. These people are sick and in need of help. To even think of anyone treating my daughter (her name is Hannah also) in this fashion is totally unconscionable. I too own many firearms, and this is not what our forefathers intended them to be used for. And seeing all the comments in support of his immature and moronic behavior only lends to help explain the horrific mess our once great country is now in. Thank you Kelly for allowing me to vent and furthermore thank you for keeping up your support for what is good and right, and May God Bless You and Your Family.
Nice grouping on the shots!! Watched this video 2 times and can see and hear the heavy disappointment with his daughter. This seems to be the only way this father can communicate with his daughter so he used what tools he had to get her attention. Oh and if you actually “watched and listened” to it, her mother wanted him to put a round in for her also of which he obliged. He blew away a inanimate object, BIG DEAL! Seems allot of you folks like to think your opinions and methods are the only one’s that are right, guess what? Your wrong!
P.S I would have used a shotgun
I just subscribed and realized I left my name as first and last…a little too personal! Couldn’t figure out how to fix it or contact you otherwise (I am very new to this kind of media). Could I just follow you as Nancy?
Looking forward to reading more.
I have decided to subscribe to this blog, after following a link from mothering.com on the topic. I feel the need to keep following this discussion for my own sanity. I live in Canada and I am glad we don’t have easy access to handguns. I did watch the video, but I had to stop when it got to the point where the dad pointed the gun at the computer. I don’t need to see that to participate in the conversation. To me, it is just straight violence. I have a little girl and I am interested in this blog, because it seems respectful and maybe helpful in navigating the coming years (she is turning 8) in a way that will help us stay close and loving through her adolescence.
No, you’re not the only one troubled by it. The fact that the go-to solution for teaching her a lesson was destroying something is absurd. He’s acting like a child or worse.
There are many solutions to discipline problems that don’t involve being so dramatic. What, for example, does this teach? What opportunity is there to go forward from the discipline situation?
Everyone I’ve seen supporting it applauds him for enforcing his rules. While that’s a good thing, I think that there’s a lot of room between loosey-goosey parenting and shooting your daughter’s laptop on camera.
What is she supposed to take into her adult life? If you have a problem with someone, blow stuff away? I would argue that that’s not a healthy lesson.
i don’t know that people, parents in particular, are applauding the man’s use of a gun to drive home a lesson. i think, at least in part, the accolades are due to the fact that he had made a promise in response to previous, patterned behavior, and his daughter blatantly disregarded that promise, passing it off as negligible or the rantings of a furious, but largely ineffective, parent. while it shows an incredible anger and frustration, and yes hurt, he did what he thought was right to teach his child, in a manner he believed would get through her stubborn, teenaged skull. and though you may not agree with his own particular brand of justice, you can bet this is a lesson his daughter will carry with her, for good or bad.
and you can rant and rave about the rabid decline of our country as a whole, desensitization and the like, but what in the world do you think would have happened a mere 20, 40 or 60 years ago had a daughter dared utter what she did about her family? you think a sharp slap across the face, being locked in a closet, or much much worse, is preferable to taking vengeance on an inanimate object? the posting of the video was extreme, it was over the top, and it was scary, but in no way did he threaten his daughter’s health or physical being; belief that it does comes from the viewer’s own personal interpretation.
insofar as humiliation is concerned, how is what he did any more or less humiliating than the father who posts on his child’s facebook page that his son wet the bed until he was 12, or the mother who shows up at a party that their child isn’t supposed to be attending, yelling their name and promising retribution? parents are the bane of the teenager’s social status; just breathing is enough to cause mortification of the highest order. the only difference here is that this father intended to make an example for others to see, and in a manner that hit a lot of nerves.
it may not agree with your own beliefs as far as child rearing and discipline are concerned, (hell, it doesn’t even agree with mine) but at the end of the day, parents aren’t perfect either. he followed through on a promise he made to his daughter, and they’ve both (presumably) learned from the fallout of this debacle. but there is no way, no possibility, that there is not one single moment in your parenting life that you haven’t thought back to something you’ve done to discipline your child, closed your eyes and admitted, even if only to yourself, that you’ve made a mistake. allow this father the ability to make those mistakes too, rather than immediately using him as a measuring stick by which all parents today fail.
true failure would have been allowing that girl to continue to denigrate her family unheeded. it would have been letting her believe that her actions are acceptable, her snide comments warranted, and her conviction that she is right unassailable. worse, failure would be to allow her to believe that her actions have no tangible consequence.
i say kudos to him for taking a stand and doing what he felt was right, rather then doing what so many other parents are wont to do: turning a blind eye, or making another empty threat. and if he has learned, as he says he has, that his own actions carry repercussions, then the entire exercise has been an all-around success.
Bobbi, thank you for your thoughtful response.
In the NY Times blog piece on this issue, one father pointed out that if she had been in Afghanistan, it would have been the girl that was shot, not her computer. I don’t know if that is true, but for me, it’s less this particular family’s drama/choices and more what it seems to mean to the rest of us that I am exploring.
I hope you might take the time to read my follow up post:
Gun aren’t the only weapons of humiliation, intimidation and disrespect, though they certainly are one of them. Words are, too. That includes words in videos, words on Facebook, and public blogs. It doesn’t matter the age of the parent or the child. Disrespect and lack of compassion takes many forms, and cannot be hidden behind clever language and attempts at justification. I can see what some are saying about the apple not falling far from the tree, in this case and in others.
There are so many kinds of violence, of which we’re all guilty–violations of boundaries (emotional and psychological, as well as physical), violations of other’s feelings in the name of “self expression”. Using public words to fight private battles is, IMHO, tacky to say the least. We just seem more ready to see it in others than in ourselves, and this is unfortunate. It does not lead to peace or understanding or greater compassion.
You argue that this is about American culture. I agree, but not quite in the same way. Whether we like it or not, part of American culture is about the right of self-protection and the right to bear arms. I have not watched the video. On its face, it sounds like something only an idiot would do. If he’d kicked the computer or smashed it against a wall or dropped a bowling ball on the device, it would have had the same effect. It sounds like he believes that destruction of someone else’s property over a perceived or real personal slight is acceptable practice. To me, it suggests that he is small-minded, emotionally insecure, and infantile. That some Americans are like that is not surprising. That other Americans are willing to have adult discussions about whether this is good or bad parenting also is not surprising. I suppose what surprises me is that it somehow qualifies as news.
I’m 22 years old, I’m no kid, but I’m no parent either. You make it sound like “father using gun to teach a lesson,” is “father puts a bullet in daughter’s leg so she doesn’t leave the house.” Facebook Is a place to talk with each other, vent, and socialize, sure, but think about the fact that if you post something, everyone can see it. If you listen to the father and read his responses (he even discusses his daughters reactions), you would definitely get a better understanding of what and why. You can do the back and forth argument about chores and allowance all day, but her post was rude, hidden, and mean. Not just to her family, but to family friends (watch the vid, you’ll see why). Every kid deserves privacy, but her getting caught was the dog’s fault. Seriously. It goes with the old saying, “if you haven’t got anything nice to say, don’t say anything at all.” As far as the father’s reaction? He could have used a baseball bat, or a flight of stairs. He could have even just dropped the laptop in the pool. She was warned there would be a reaction as this was not the first time that she used Facebook to “vent” or whatever you’d like to call it. At 15, you should understand the consequences of what your actions are. If she didn’t then, she does now. Would you encourage your daughter to post that she’s “sick of your bullshit” and “can’t wait for the day where you’re too old to wipe your ass?” Discipline comes in a variety of forms. Respect comes in one.
Humiliation would look the same whether with a baseball bat or a flight of stairs.
The gun is a whole other matter. I think we might be confusing “respect” with intimidation.
Here is the meaning of respect:
The thing is, the whole video really had nothing to do with intimidation. It had to do with the fact that he thinks she needs to do her responsibilities, and treat her parents, the cleaning lady, and herself with respect. In no way is he trying to scare her. He is only saying that it is hurtful to the cleaning lady and her parents to talk of them so badly in a public place, and that the attitude, and swear words she uses, are really not worthy of her and show a lack of respect for herself. People can complain all day about the gun, but he did not use the gun in a way that warrant the complaints about it. It was used against the laptop, that is it. He shows that he is mad at her, but is absolutely not disrespectful of her.
Well then, I guess we should all go out and get guns to teach our teenagers respect.
That would be much simpler than my approach.
That’s a very limited definition of respect. Respect also includes a health fear of the consequences of disrespect!
Fear is not an expression of respect, but it is very much a tool of manipulation.
Yes, but Facebook is a privilege, not a right. You still have not addressed what the girl has done. Again, there was a previous threat to put a bullet through the computer. Humiliation is having your parents find out that you’ve written something like she did. I do agree with Brandi that the video was not about intimidation, but more of a rebuttal across the same medium which the daughter had used in the first place.
For me, the issue of the daughter’s behavior is irrelevant, completely.
And believe me, I’m a tough Mama. Ask my boys 🙂
That her father chose to “communicate” with her “across the same medium” is disappointing.
Parents aren’t in the business of giving “rebuttals.”
We’re here to teach.
Sometimes that means swallowing our pride.
But not our rules.
I can do that without a gun. I think he can too.
I’m a father of four boys, ages 9 to 19.
I did see the video, and it’s painful. It’s actually more sad than painful. First, the father’s actions only served to make a bad situation worse.
I’m going to try not to weave this post full of platitudes and clichés but that’s not going to be easy because this really comes down to values and basic parenting.
As painful as his daughter’s actions are, the father is the parent and therefore has to set the example – always, not only when he’s up for the task. Can anyone honestly say that they became a kinder, more loving, more compassionate person having been treated with disrespect, humiliation or brow-beating? What lesson could the father possibly have taught his daughter? Was it that he is bigger or more powerful? Was it that he is to be feared or that he is in control of his family? Realistically, what lesson will his daughter learn? Isn’t that the most important thing?
Using the gun was indeed an attention getter, if that’s the message that he wants to send. “When things get real damn bad, shoot the shit out of something”. Yeehaa. And before anyone accuses me of being part of the anti-gun crowd, let me inform you that I own several guns. I probably own several more than many of you who argue that the father is a real man; an “American”. I would never use a gun in any manner associated with discipline or punishment – EVER. Anyone who owns and respects firearms would agree. This behavior is inexcusable and this man should not own a firearm.
I don’t want to attempt to delve too deep into the family’s issues, but I will say that the problem goes far deeper than a “rebellious teen”. I don’t even use that term and I don’t agree with it. It’s overused and typically applied as a label to any kid that expresses anything that the parents don’t understand or agree with.
The daughter’s post on facebook is an obvious expression of frustration, even if one would interpret it as exaggerated – which we don’t know to be the case. The father’s pain is obvious. He probably feels that he is doing the best he can do. He most likely works very hard and gives to his family in the best way he knows how. He’s probably fearful and one would assume, he wants the best for his daughter. He’s also seemingly unaware of what he may be doing to undermine his own intentions. He’s hurt, confused, and frustrated.
His daughter on the other hand can’t understand why he pushes her so hard. She doesn’t understand the challenging world that he is trying to prepare her for. This could go on and on, but it doesn’t have to.
When in doubt, love. When you’re wrong, apologize. When you’re not wrong apologize. Where your kids are concerned, show them how you want them to be. When they don’t respond, you have to continue to set the example. You are the parent, and you cannot be reactionary.
Sometimes you have to absorb some of your kids’ misdirected frustration. Sometimes you have to just reach out and give them a hug and tell them you love them. We have to take the time to reach out and understand them, even when they fail to reach out in a way that we understand or appreciate. On the other hand, I suppose you could just take out your gun and shoot up their belongings. If you don’t understand the value of compassion, forgiveness and love in raising a child then you probably think the father did the right thing.
Good luck with that.
Last night I went to sleep wondering how this might have played out if this man was responding to his son rather than his daughter; and how that might shape how the rest of the country views it; and what that continues to mean about men and women and power in this country.
Using a gun to destroy property if someone doesn’t listen to you? I can’t believe there is actually a discussion on whether this is right or wrong.
I agree with Lou Ann
Well there is a discussion. And while we’re at it, why is it wrong?
You’re right, he destroyed property, a laptop, an inanimate object. All it says to me is “respect is more important than a laptop. Noone is born deserving a laptop, respect and hard work come first”
What exactly is wrong with that?
Oh yea, the gun. Well guns can be violent weapons, but to some people they are just guns… that are only violent when used against living things. Not laptops.
Well, many people feel this way so you’re in good company. Are you a woman? If you are then you might be able to understand how the use of a gun by anyone, let alone a man who is bigger and stronger than you, and who is your father, and thus holds both your love and devotion as well as the home and money that you rely upon is in a place of incredible power over you, especially in the destruction upon an item that you rely upon.
For me, destroying the laptop was an inherently violent act, just as it would have been if he used a baseball bat.
Perhaps these other posts may shed some light on your question:
Would Father Have Used Facebook and a Gun to Teach his SON a Lesson?
Father Who Used FB to Teach His Daughter A Lesson: A Human Rights Issue
15 year olds are supposed to bash their parents. . .it is the beginning of separation. If a 15 year old does not have the privacy to be a teenager with her friends, what is that really saying? Violence is the way to deal with embarrassment? No one should take a 15 year old’s rant personally.
Right… i was telling my aunt (who had the disappointing “this mans a hero” reaction) something similar last night… she says “she had it coming!”… how many 15 year old girls say something bad about their parents, i’d say somewhere between 99%-100% of them. Do they all “have it coming”?
Nothing electronic is ever private, especially Facebook. Fact is, email and Facebook postings are about as private as shouting out on the market square!
I agree, but the key word is “private”. If you see your child writing on public site that she “should not have to do chores, and can’t wait until you’re old, and can’t wipe your own ass, and she won’t want to take care of you”, you’d be doing her a disservice to let her think that that’s ok.
Isn’t a parent’s job to help a child learn right from wrong? How can you do that if you see them doing “wrong” and think “well, she’s 15, she’s supposed to be that way, I better just let it be”
Great question. I agree that a parent needs to communicate when a child has crossed a line, particular one so hurtful.
I just think there are MANY other ways to do it than Mr. Jordan did; ones that are truly educational in a way that is not at all humiliating, intimidating or destructive. What I realize when I really listen to readers comments on my blog and elsewhere, is that many people are really at their wits end, and almost feel vindicated by Mr. Jordan’s action. As an lifetime educator, that tells me that parents need to go back to the classroom.
See these follow up posts with some alternatives around communicating with teens:
Parenting without Power (or a gun)
Dear Mr. Jordan & Other Parents Frustrated with Teens & Chores
Thanks for you insight.
So, you didn’t see the video, or the posts, or anything related to this, but your opinion is the father is wrong? What’s wrong with the country is too many pansies laying out their ill-informed opinion for blog hits. If this archaic way of parenting disturbs your hope for the future, stop, put down your mochachino, and think quietly to yourself, “How did the country get here in the first place?” It sure wasn’t French parenting and politeness. Nor was it applying baseless opinion from well outside the situation.
My thoughts exactly (by the way, nice use of mochachino). Rock on!
I guess you haven’t see my view count if you think this blog is focused on hits.
That said, I do appreciate my readers, especially those who are willing to join in the conversation like you.
My focus on the Empty(ing) Nest is children, parenting and living/loving with teenagers as they prepare to leave the nest.
And by the way, I’m a tea drinker.
So let me get this straight, you haven’t actually read the posts by father and daughter nor have you seen the video, but you are perfectly wiling to pass judgement on it? *THAT* is what is wrong with this country; the ignorant passing judgement on what they can’t understand.
All I needed to know is: father using gun to teach a lesson.
You’ve lived in peace your entire life haven’t you? He didn’t use the gun on her. He used it to destroy what she was using in her own wag to destroy the family’s image and self esteem. Plus, it was his to destroy. Spoiled, was and is the problem there and here.
Sounds to me like the father destroyed that… for the whole world to see.
He did. And that was what was especially good about it!
My father used guns to teach me many lessons. Lessons about respect, taking care of what you own, safety, self defense, self reliance, and maturity. Guns are a great tool for teaching lessons. This country, whether you choose to believe it or not, was founded by the gun. I do not agree with the father posting the video. I think matters involving family issues should stay withing the walls of the home. However, I have seen worse parenting in my short life. Like the parent who lets the child demand a chocolate bar at the supermarket…and gives in. I would say you have some valid points, but the fact that you admit to not even watching the video or reading/hearing the child’s post shows small minded intolerance and self-righteous behavior. You can’t pass judgement without the facts, otherwise your opinion is devoid of credibility.
I do not want to honor this violent and humiliating act of parenting masquerading as teaching respect.
My focus is on all those who deem it heroic.
I do not need to read a teenager’s rant to imagine it. I am the parent of two, the oldest of 8, and a lifelong educator.
I know the many shades of teenager, first-hand.
As far as Mr. Jordan’s video; there was no more I needed to know than: “used a gun on his teenager’s computer.”
When it comes to children, I am righteous; and I will make judgements.
As a woman approaching 50, I’ve earned it!
Righteous is not quite the same thing as self-righteous!
He shot a LAPTOP for goodness sake, that is not violence. Hurting people is violence.
His shooting the laptop says, “laptops are not important, respect and hard work are important”. That sound like a pretty good point to me.
This father is unfortunate that he used a gun, and that some people think of guns and think “oh god, violence!”. But some people, like himself based on what he portrays himself to be on Facebook think of guns and think “oh guns, yea I live in the country, and everyone around here uses them. Sometimes we use them for shooting inanimate targets as a form of fun, but we sure don’t use them for shooting people”
His biggest crime is that he used a tool which other people jump to conclusions about. Oh, and that his video went viral, which to be fair, really stinks for his daughter. But he didn’t know that would happen, and they are trying to deal with it together.
I too live in rurally where many hunt, including the teenage daughter of my closest neighbor. My issue is not with guns per se; or with what Mr. Jordan was attempting to communicate; It’s with HOW he communicated it; and that he posted it on Facebook.
After reading the brief bio under your picture, I was actually very shocked to read this reply from you. I know nothing about you, this is my first time visiting your blog. But, as a lifetime educator, I can’t help but be surprised that you would jump to such a quick judgement about someone and something you know absolutely nothing about.
This man, Tommy Jordan, did something extreme. Whether or not it was right is not up to anyone but him and his daughter’s mother to decide. Here are some facts about the video:
1. His daughter was not present when he made the video.
2. He did not make the video in a blind fit of rage.
3. He explained and described the entire situation, including his daughter’s reaction in his facebook page.
Now, without this becoming a retelling, I will just say that his daughter was not traumatized, or victimized or abused in any way. Mr. Jordan shot her laptop solely because he had warned her that he would do so if she continued her behavior. While many are outraged because he resorted to such “violent” means. One has to question whether all this outrage is colored by negative preconceptions of firearms and firearm owners instead of by what actually happened and the circumstances surrounding it. I happen to think that the lesson he taught his daughter was an important one. He taught her to respect his word about consequences, that if he says something he means it. Again, it might have been using an extreme method, but I am no one to judge. From the follow up posts and other videos he has posted in the past, his daughter is no stranger to guns. He taught her how to shoot and has videos of them at the range. This tells me that him shooting her laptop was seen as an act of violence by his daughter, rather follow through on a warning he gave her. According to his posts, she was shocked that he went through with it. This Ultra-Violent method he used only seems that way in the minds of those on the outside. This is no different than me telling my 6 year old daughter that I will take away her Nintendo DS if she doesn’t listen to her mother, something that I have followed through with in the past. The last time I did that was permanent. That was 6 months ago and we haven’t had that issue with her since. Children need to learn to take their parents seriously.
I have followed this story closely because I became intrigued at the amount of people jumping to conclusions just because a gun was involved. It was sad to see the number of “Ignorant Redneck” comments from people that, like the this post’s author, never bothered to click PLAY.
Is it so hard to try and understand another person before forming an opinion of them?
Greetings Fellow Educator,
Mr. Jordan lost his rights to privacy by sharing the humiliation of his daughter on video, wouldn’t you agree?
That said, it is less his actions that concern me and more the applauding of them by so many others.
Again, I think there is a confusion around the word respect. See definition above.
Alas, the gun is not the issue when it comes to humiliation. As one reader mentioned above, it could have been a baseball bat or a flight of stairs.
Where the gun comes into play is with regard to intimidation.
A gun is a weapon of killing.
What you share about the daughter’s exposure to guns is comforting to me. At least she knows how to use one too.
Hopefully she has more self-control in the use of her fire-arms.
(To which I might add, you are incorrect in your assumption about me and guns–I took rifle lessons at age 13 at West Point Military Academy.)
What troubles me is just how many people watched this and thought it was cool. We can be sure this isn’t the last we’ll see with regard to vigilante parenting; and the outcomes, no doubt, may be more tragic than a teenager being humiliated in front of the world.
The bottom line here Jon, is that you believe that the fathers reaction is justified. A 15 year old girl complaining about her parents (which is very common), is met with public humiliation, aggression, youtube and a handgun. Most people with a lick of sense would tell you, that this is not the appropriate reaction from an adult. Living with a person like that, is probably a nightmare. The fact that you are trying to compare you taking away your kids nintendo DS (appropriately, in private, without a weapon), to this, is laughable. And you are a teacher Jon? Jesus.
she didn’t need to… i’ve seen the video,,, the author is right on.
an idiot father shoots up a laptop because he was so appalled by what her read on her facebook wall. he parents through humiliation and intimidation… youtube and bullets are his preferred means to handle a problem… this is filed under “you reap what you sow”. the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree… do you know why the daughter wrote all that nasty stuff (which wasn’t really that nasty)? Probably because her fathers an @sshole. He raised her to do this, he’s acted as her example.
Hear, hear, Kelly.
I’ve thinking about the French parenting polite children thing for a while, because it took time for me to figure out what was off about it. I realized that as a parent who worked very hard to instill the value of being polite and mostly failed at it, that the culture my kids grew up in had to take some of the blame for that.
We are steeped in a culture of violence and dramatic acting out. Ye ole’ rugged individualist packs a gun. As a society we are paying a very high price for this immature illusion.
Are these the same “polite” French kids that several years ago staged massive uprisings and exhibited anarchist behavior? The ones that forced the government to declare a national state of emergency…FOR THREE MONTHS!? No, seriously! Are those the ones you’re referring too? I eagerly await your response…
JD, perhaps you shoulld look up “straw man argument”, because you’re coming really dangerously close here.
Considering the way of the world today, I think it is fortunate that he did not shoot her!!!
Not true! It’d be extremely UNFORTUNATE if he shot her, and NORMAL that he didn’t. Considering the way of the world today? I really don’t see it being common for fathers to shoot their daughters. THAT would be a scary world…
Actually it is a very violent world for women, and even for daughters and wives. Google some statistics on that.